• Few questions about cheaters.cfg
    184 replies, posted
  • Avatar of garry
  • It targets and detects specific cheats, not generic function calls from Lua.
  • Avatar of Wizard of Ass
  • I doubt this anti-cheat reacts on anything lua based. I suspect that it might detect certain function calls that shouldn't appear, or detecting detours.
  • [QUOTE=garry;35727457]It targets and detects specific cheats, not generic function calls from Lua.[/QUOTE] Will it also be activated on servers that don't run ScriptEnforcer?
  • I run a [url=http://gmod.game-host.org/server/motd.html]Deathmatch-based Sandbox[/url] gamemode server *without* ScriptEnforcer, because i allow wallhacks/ESP's. Will this new system start banning people for using simple lua wallhacks & ESPs? (eg Falco's) EDIT: And I've written my own anti-cheat system that takes care of the rest.
  • Avatar of boxxyy
  • [QUOTE=mfsinc;35727953]I run a [url=http://gmod.game-host.org/server/motd.html]Deathmatch-based Sandbox[/url] gamemode server *without* ScriptEnforcer, because i allow wallhacks/ESP's. Will this new system start banning people for using simple lua wallhacks & ESPs? (eg Falco's) EDIT: And I've written my own anti-cheat system that takes care of the rest.[/QUOTE] Well it obviously doesn't detect the cheat when it injects, so I assume that's a yes.
  • Avatar of Chewgum
  • [QUOTE=mfsinc;35727953]I run a [url=http://gmod.game-host.org/server/motd.html]Deathmatch-based Sandbox[/url] gamemode server *without* ScriptEnforcer, because i allow wallhacks/ESP's. Will this new system start banning people for using simple lua wallhacks & ESPs? (eg Falco's) EDIT: And I've written my own anti-cheat system that takes care of the rest.[/QUOTE] If the wallhacks/ESPs are written in lua, it probably won't trigger garrys system.
  • Avatar of Clavus
  • [QUOTE=garry;35727457]It targets and detects specific cheats, not generic function calls from Lua.[/QUOTE] My guess is something like VAC, where it detects the signatures of DLLs hooked into the game? At least that's how some people claimed that VAC worked.
  • [QUOTE=Alex_grist;35729995]GAC?[/QUOTE] Great name I suggest you use it +1
  • Avatar of Deceptor13
  • I think this is really funny, I am in a community called TDRP, and some guy no body likes logged on the first day this happened, and he had seth hack. He turned on his speedhack then got banned from every server in gmod. We all laughed because no body liked him and he was raging on our fourms.
  • Avatar of jman6495
  • It's totally fair that you want to ban cheaters, However hiding the location at which you obtained the information and being so generally vague about this worries me, How can we be sure only cheaters are being banned ? How can we trust this system ? You say it detects cheats, I'm interested in how (what it actually detects) and if it's ANYTHING any addon MAY use Then I suggest publishing a list to addon devs to make sure they don't accidentally gun doof and end up with all their users banned, irreversably . Just worried .... A friend asked me to add this : I can just imagine Someone making a admin wallhack for a sandbox server and taking the wallhack code from a lua cheat Then getting every admin banned from everything on MP What disturbs me is that there's really only two ways this can work 1: Taking "known cheater lists" which are incomplete and inaccurate 2: Using a self-made system to detect lua cheats that might ban similar/same code as the cheats(even when it's not one) PS . I'm totally for the ban of hackers and cheaters, It's a pain in the ass, If this system is legit, and it works then I support it totally.
  • Avatar of Drakehawke
  • [QUOTE=DarthTealc;35727302] What about single player? What about sandbox servers which don't use Scriptenforcer? I was once an admin of a (now dead) community where the sandbox server didn't use scriptenforcer, and I used a radar and x-ray addon to help me administrate. Would I get banned for that if I did the same thing today? What about addons which have functionality similar to common hacks? For example, a TTT server I currently help administrate has a detective item which allows the detective to see through walls and see what the players are holding. Would that cause all our players to be banned? Do people only get banned if they hack on scriptenforcer servers (aka bypass scriptenforcer)? Eg as long as you're not able to use the hack on the server, you're okay? [/QUOTE] [img]http://puu.sh/rLZI[/img]
  • Avatar of garry
  • [QUOTE=jman6495;35731300]It's totally fair that you want to ban cheaters, However hiding the location at which you obtained the information and being so generally vague about this worries me, How can we be sure only cheaters are being banned ? How can we trust this system ? You say it detects cheats, I'm interested in how (what it actually detects) and if it's ANYTHING any addon MAY use Then I suggest publishing a list to addon devs to make sure they don't accidentally gun doof and end up with all their users banned, irreversably . Just worried .... A friend asked me to add this : I can just imagine Someone making a admin wallhack for a sandbox server and taking the wallhack code from a lua cheat Then getting every admin banned from everything on MP What disturbs me is that there's really only two ways this can work 1: Taking "known cheater lists" which are incomplete and inaccurate 2: Using a self-made system to detect lua cheats that might ban similar/same code as the cheats(even when it's not one) PS . I'm totally for the ban of hackers and cheaters, It's a pain in the ass, If this system is legit, and it works then I support it totally.[/QUOTE] You've got to trust me to make the right decisions. That's all you can do. The system has to be ambiguous or it won't work.
  • Avatar of nexitem
  • Maybe he was paying the SH maker shitload of money to give him a list of people who bought it. This makes no sense at all what ever I'm a Blob.
  • [QUOTE=garry;35732129]You've got to trust me to make the right decisions. That's all you can do. The system has to be ambiguous or it won't work.[/QUOTE] Server admins should be able to opt-out of the system for their own servers, and/or it shouldn't ban if ScriptEnforcer is off. So by turning SE off the server owner is allowing everything, and it's up to them to decide what's a cheat and what isn't.
  • Avatar of alexgrist
  • [QUOTE=mfsinc;35732480]Server admins should be able to opt-out of the system for their own servers, and/or it shouldn't ban if ScriptEnforcer is off.[/QUOTE] Delete cheaters.cfg, done.
  • Avatar of Drakehawke
  • [QUOTE=Alex_grist;35732829]Delete cheaters.cfg, done.[/QUOTE] That's not the point, they can still be detected and banned from every other GMod server if ScriptEnforcer or VAC is on or not.
  • Avatar of alexgrist
  • [QUOTE=Drakehawke;35733271]That's not the point, they can still be detected and banned from every other GMod server if ScriptEnforcer or VAC is on or not.[/QUOTE] I don't understand why you want to allow the cheaters.. Why shouldn't we be able to detect them, you've got the choice to remove it from your servers and it's up to others to remove it from theirs if they so wish.
  • Avatar of moesislack
  • The people who cheat shouldn't be allowed to play. Garry can't tell anyone how it works because then it stops working. It's like a security guard who works at the bank just telling you the door codes and how to get into the vault and out without being caught. Personally I think Garry made this game and if you can't trust him with making a simple anti cheat and ban list how can you even play the game? If you really need to run a hack or cheat to test some anti cheat or to administrate your server then make a new gmod account for $9.99 and use that. Seriously guys it's 10 dollars for gmod and if you're doing something like making anti cheat or you're an admin then you have to have test accounts.
  • [QUOTE=Alex_grist;35733396]I don't understand why you want to allow the cheaters.. Why shouldn't we be able to detect them, you've got the choice to remove it from your servers and it's up to others to remove it from theirs if they so wish.[/QUOTE] Cheating is relative in GMod. Wallhacks/ESPs are allowed on my sandbox-DM server. [img_thumb]http://puu.sh/rNEn[/img_thumb] I wouldn't like it banning people [b]from every gmod server[/b] who use a simple lua script to see where things are on a large map. This is especially true for sandbox servers.
  • Avatar of Drakehawke
  • [QUOTE=mfsinc;35734081]Cheating is relative in GMod. Wallhacks/ESPs are allowed on my sandbox-DM server. [img_thumb]http://puu.sh/rNEn[/img_thumb] I wouldn't like it banning people [B]from every gmod server[/B] who use a simple lua script to see where things are on a large map. This is especially true for sandbox servers.[/QUOTE] I don't think it detects Lua hacks unless ScriptEnforcer is on and they're bypassing it (i.e. running a script the server didn't send them). Not sure though, it'd be silly if it did.
  • Avatar of alexgrist
  • [QUOTE=mfsinc;35734081]Cheating is relative in GMod. Wallhacks/ESPs are allowed on my sandbox-DM server.[/QUOTE] Then just remove the cheaters.cfg file like I said before.. Is deleting a file really that difficult?
  • [QUOTE=Alex_grist;35734507]Then just remove the cheaters.cfg file like I said before.. Is deleting a file really that difficult?[/QUOTE] You seem to be failing to understand that deleting cheaters.cfg will only have the bans not be actually executed on your server. It's still possible that people get banned on your server.
  • Avatar of Drakehawke
  • [QUOTE=Alex_grist;35734507]Then just remove the cheaters.cfg file like I said before.. Is deleting a file really that difficult?[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=mfsinc;35734081] I wouldn't like it banning people [b]from every gmod server[/b] who use a simple lua script to see where things are on a large map. This is especially true for sandbox servers.[/QUOTE]
  • Avatar of garry
  • Where are you getting your hard facts from Goz3rr [editline]27th April 2012[/editline] If you want people to be able to cheat on your server - you should probably turn Script Enforcer off? [editline]27th April 2012[/editline] If you want people to be able to cheat on your server - you should probably turn Script Enforcer off?
  • [QUOTE=garry;35734838]Where are you getting your hard facts from Goz3rr [/QUOTE] From what i saw cheaters.cfg just contained a bunch of banid's. How would removing that impact the actual banning? [QUOTE=garry;35734838] If you want people to be able to cheat on your server - you should probably turn Script Enforcer off?[/QUOTE] That clears pretty much all my questions, all your anti cheat does is target SE bypassing, not clientside lua scripts where SE is off.
  • Avatar of Drakehawke
  • [QUOTE=garry;35734838] If you want people to be able to cheat on your server - you should probably turn Script Enforcer off?[/QUOTE] Your blog post confused people a bit I think, you implied that normal Lua scripts which could be perceived as hacks would get players banned even on ScriptEnforcer disabled servers. You later on commented that unless you were trying to bypass Script Enforcer you'd be fine, but that wasn't clear from the original blog post.
  • [QUOTE=garry;35734838]Where are you getting your hard facts from Goz3rr [editline]27th April 2012[/editline] If you want people to be able to cheat on your server - you should probably turn Script Enforcer off? [/QUOTE] Thanks, that clears up that. I'll keep SE disabled on my server.
  • Avatar of Hentie
  • Great to hear that you're not just putting random people on a cheaters list, and that there's actually a solid system behind it.